According to Houston psychotherapist Mary Jo Rapini, the ways in which you respond to an empty nest during the very first year can have a significant impact on the rest of your life. Even “seasoned” empty nesters can benefit from the insights in this article:
And just like that, your children are grown and gone. Literally overnight the nest is empty, your house seems eerily quiet, and you’ve abruptly entered what is often called the second half of life. “Emptynesthood” ushers in all kinds of changes and can affect you in ways you could be overlooking. What is normal? How do you maintain or improve your sense of well-being and quality of life going forward, while honoring the changes your family is also going through?
Meet psychotherapist Mary Jo Rapini of Houston, Texas. Mary Jo has insights and suggestions for you. She is an expert on relationships and intimacy, and you’ll find her extensive bio below this article. Mary Jo is well-respected in her field, a sought-after contributing guest on local and national television, and she is a popular keynote speaker. This is the first in a series of interviews with Mary Jo about our empty nest years.
Mary Jo has also graciously agreed to interact with us in the Conversations section about her advice.
Today we’re talking about life in the first year of an empty nest, and the powerful ways it can affect us. Mary Jo also helps us understand the markedly different ways that a mother and father with traditional child-rearing roles usually respond to an empty nest.
Empty Nest Network Welcome, Mary Jo! I’m so glad you can join me and be a part of our network of parents.
Mary Jo Rapini Thank you, Lisa! I’m very glad that I can be of help.
ENN We often hear of “empty nest syndrome”. What is it really, and how does it affect parents internally?
MJo Empty Nest Syndrome is an emotional concept and very real. It’s important to speak first about the “investment” each parent makes in a family. I think it is fair to say that in most traditional families, the mom is taking the majority of the load. The emotional load, the activity load, everything to do with that child. Mothers are more emotionally invested. Whereas, the father has been more of a “support” person. He has been there as a supportive force for the family, but the mother carries the emotional aspect. So internally, when that child moves out, she is going to go through it more deeply.
ENN Describe for us how a mother and dad each react to an empty nest.
MJo In a healthy marriage, the dad is going to respond more to his wife’s feelings for a while, before dealing with his. The second year is actually so fascinating because typically, during that first year the mother has been adjusting, and then the dad will start his adjustment after that time. Once she’s adjusted, he will then start lamenting about how much he misses the child. So it is a kind of latent reaction for dads, which you see in a lot of grief work between men and women. This is one important reason why a man will not do as well with his wife over the death of a child, because he grieves in such a different way. In a healthy marriage, things are so intricately timed that whichever partner is emoting, usually the mother, the other partner will put their feelings on hold while that is happening. And try to support them. Then, once the partner is better, they will begin grieving. But by then, many times the wife is really confused by that. It can cause a lot of dissension and resentment. She might say, “You were never there for me in my grief. You didn’t share in my grief”. But he really did. He was waiting for her to finish grieving.
ENN Very interesting, Mary Jo. You’re saying it can be that same dynamic for an empty nest couple, and their different ways of grieving can cause misunderstanding. Tell us now about a mother’s response to a child leaving home, which I assume can be stronger if she has been a stay-at-home-parent.
MJo Right. She feels abandoned, she feels confused and lost, and she may wonder what her purpose is now, because she’s identified so much with raising her child as her purpose in life. It has given her total well-being. And really, that sense of well-being should in fact escalate once you launch a child into college, but it often doesn’t. Because your child doesn’t need you anymore, you feel that, and so you have to grieve that loss, first. Only then can you start benefiting from the fact that with your child, you did exactly what you were supposed to do. You launched them. Now, you can absorb and celebrate that fact.
ENN What does a mother usually want to talk about when she comes in to see you? Does she come in saying she thinks she’s going through empty nest syndrome?
MJo It’s never that they’re coming in specifically for empty nest. They’re coming in for a neglected marriage, cheating, affairs at this stage. Sometimes depression. Depression from the underlying effect from when their child left to go to college. I’ve seen all types, because it depends on how much they are grieving. But with any grief, especially with empty nest, you’ll usually see 6-9 months of “floundering around”. A woman might come in worrying a lot about her age, with her menopause happening around that time, and she’s having a hard time with it. It’s almost like she minimizes the grief from the empty nest, but when she’s talking, it’s always muddled in with it. And actually, women have a harder time getting older than with any other transition. In fact, if you ask the majority of women, “Would you rather be 10 years younger or 10-15 pounds lighter”, they’ll say, “I would rather be 10 years younger.” It’s a real loss for some women of what they had as an essential power, or influence. It’s incredible. I personally don’t like getting older, but my life is so full, and I have filled it. If you exclusively fill it with your kids then you’re going to have problems in the transition.
ENN Of course that makes sense. What else do you see in mothers at this stage?
MJo Sometimes, a woman will take up outlandish things like saying “I’m going to go climb Mt. Kilimanjaro”. Which is okay if that’s a new goal and they start training, and planning. But many times, they don’t. They’re just after some adventure to make them feel like they did while they were raising their kids.
ENN To try to fill that emotional hole.
MJo Right. When we go through empty nest, there are so many “arms” to it that are actually playing a part. You’re getting older. Your bodies are transitioning, as well. Your youth, as you knew it, and shared it with this child, is now gone.
ENN This makes me think of a friend from Europe who told me she’d never heard of empty nest and didn’t seem to understand the concept. What do you think about this?
MJo For women in the US, empty nest is very strongly tied to aging, as we’ve talked about. American women fret a whole lot about aging. Whereas, Europeans don’t fret about aging. It is not an insult to them. In the US, it’s an insult to age, and it’s also an insult to take your time. To not be busy. Americans will ask each other “What are you doing now?” We need to see how everyone is spending their time, all of the time. My husband has family in Italy, and I see these differences in them. The Europeans also have very deep and longstanding friendships for support.
ENN How can we get past this kind of thinking?
MJo With empty nest, some of the wisest people are able to sit back, see the big picture, know what is essential and important in life, so they can appreciate the beauty of it. And for example, to allow time take in what your God wants for you now. A very large part of the empty nest struggle can be about the acceptance of things.
ENN It does sound like it’s important not to let yourself avoid going through the emotional transition with empty nest.
MJo Yes. I think with empty nest what it does is it hits you, you’re going along in life, busy and doing all that you do, and all of a sudden, your child graduates and you’re taking them to college and no matter who you are, you can’t deny the loss. You can do things to your face, to your body, you can buy new clothes, but you can’t hide that you have to go through the transition, and the empty nest is real. You need to face that.
ENN That reminds me of when I was dictating some content for this site and whenever I dictated “empty nest syndrome” it typed “emptiness syndrome”. Ironic, and true.
MJo Yes! That is exactly what it is. So, usually during that time I tell women, “It’s better if you just allow that feeling of discomfort. Just observe it, and don’t judge it. It’s all normal, so go with it. Allow it.” For sure, do some journaling.
It would be good if women have someone to go through it with, and talk about how they feel, but most of the time, they don’t. They might go to other women, and depending on the quality of the friend’s support and what they say to her, it gives her some ideas.
ENN Now let’s talk about fathers. When Dad, as you say, starts lamenting now that Mom has adjusted to the empty nest, how does he usually express it?
MJo He’ll come in and start talking about things the child used to do. And what they did together. If he’s comfortable, he might say he misses them. But it’s usually that he misses the child’s presence. The noise. He describes ways that he misses what the child used to bring to his life. The connection.
But also, even before college, with dads I have seen that in high school when there is a turn of attention to their friends, really involved dads can have a very difficult time. Especially with sons, because a lot of the dads have been involved with the child through scouting and other activities, where dads also had friends through those events. So, when their child no longer needs or wants those involvements with their father, it can be very difficult for him.
ENN You’re saying the dad starts feeling left out of his son’s life and feels loss as early as high school?
MJo Yes, he feels abandoned and left out. And a real sense of rejection. That can be hard to take.
ENN I’d never thought of that. For the parents who come to see you in their empty nest years, how often do you see depression or anxiety? How are they coping?
MJo It’s very different for women and men, because men often turn to substance abuse – alcohol or illicit drugs – to feel normal. The anxiety, though, is higher for women. It is generally true for women that they struggle more from anxiety than men do. And the depression from the empty nest is what we categorize as an adjustment depression during the adjustment period. That can last 18 months to be a full adjustment disorder, which is what clinicians usually call this type of depression. And it’s situational. It eventually will transition away. The mom and dad will find new ways to deal with it.
Most people that come in to me are able to cope and have the skills they need. They just need to be taught how to use them. Things like meditation and reflection, journaling. Revisiting your faith, whatever that is. And friends. Friends really are so important. I would tell everybody I know the most important thing you can do after the age of 40 is to cultivate good friends. Because they kind of stop at a certain point. You get busy and tend to neglect them. You need them.
ENN I agree. In fact, I’ve really benefited from that myself. Our readers can take a look in my Conversations section at “The Importance of Friendships during our empty nest years”.
MJo Oh yes. It’s really important. And it helps your marriage, too. Because when you have really good friends, they try to remind you what they see in your partner. And that kind of support helps you at different times, because all marriages have tough stages. So having different friends can remind us that we’re normal and going through the same kinds of things.
ENN What is one of the most significant ways the empty nest can change your life?
ENN Many times, this is when we see “gray divorces”. Sadly, they are the majority of divorces going on right now. Because for example, the woman in her empty nest grief reaction starts saying, “You know, I don’t have anything in common with my partner.” A lot of people have put each other off and on hold for too long while they are nurturing their kids, and now the kids are gone. They gave everything to the kids along the way, which is an unwise choice for marriages.
ENN So you might be tempted to give up on your marriage at this stage and move on, instead of wanting to improve your relationship.
MJo Yes. I have seen so many people die alone, Lisa. It’s so sad. They’ve gotten misled somehow in life, and find themselves all alone in their later years, because they let something very precious go with their marriage. An empty nest can involve grieving, but it also gives you an opportunity to celebrate that the two of you “made it through” as a couple. You parented and launched this child together, and now you can restructure your marriage to take you through the next stage. And the next stage is a long one, hopefully for most of us. It can also be the most powerful. If you think about it, you can strengthen and even re-create a marriage that you love so much in ways you’ve never thought of before.
ENN With the shift in more equal parenting roles, are you starting to see more fathers who feel the same emotional intensity and empty void as the mothers? For example, if the wife is the breadwinner, are you seeing a flipped response, so to speak?
MJo I haven’t seen as many of those yet, but I’m looking at my sons-in-law now, and their parenting is even more superb to what ours was, I feel. They are really so involved. When the child is sick, it’s not automatic that the woman takes off anymore. Even if she’s stay at home, many times the dad will come home, too. It’s so shared that my assumption is within 10 years when these families start going through the empty nest, we’re going to see different responses in the dads.
ENN Back to the self-care you talk about. Cultivating good friends, meditation, journaling to understand your feelings better, and taking time to reflect. So, while it’s ok to be still and take some time to for yourself to adjust, how do you know if you are stalling out? What’s the difference between allowing time for the transition, and stalling out?
MJo I would give myself the first year, since it’s critical, for not overdoing, and not getting overinvolved. Instead, use this time to allow yourself to get creative! Creative juices come when we are quiet and with a little bit of boredom. When we’re bored, we start getting ideas. I usually will tell clients “Let’s make a vision board. What did you ever see yourself doing? What have you been wanting to do or feel now that you’re at a point in your life when you finally have the opportunity to do it? What are some ideas?” They can just free associate on those awhile. And then after about a year, it’s time to say yes. Start saying yes, to small things. Because that’s going to build your confidence, your sense of self, your worth.
ENN I know what you mean. In my case I took some time off to reflect and then felt ready to move forward with the rest of my life, just like my children were doing with their lives. I came up with ideas that felt right and important to me at this stage. What I’d enjoy doing, just for myself. My interests were music and creating this website. I loved thinking about and planning for my ideas. With music I could fulfill a long-held interest in singing with vocal training and could use aspects of my radio-tv-film degree to record vocals. I’d share the recordings with family and friends. For this website I’d apply what I learned through many years of volunteering in Houston to help this online community, while putting some college journalism classes to use. I found a graduate student at a nearby university who was willing to consult me on my website idea and help me take first steps to develop the site. These pursuits have taken me on a wonderful creative journey and have been very fulfilling. My family is proud of me for doing these things, which also makes me happy.
MJo Absolutely, Lisa! That is just wonderful.
ENN I’ve loved talking with you, Mary Jo. Thank you for being here for us with such wonderful insights.
MJo You are very welcome, Lisa. I’m always happy to help.
To our readers:
Join me in the Conversations section where I’ll talk about this article.
Watch for future interviews with Mary Jo Rapini on Empty Nest Network
Learn more about Mary Jo at http://maryjorapini.com
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About Mary Jo Rapini, MEd, LPC
Mary Jo Rapini, MEd, LPC, is a leading psychotherapist specializing in intimacy, sex, and relationships. Based in Houston, Texas, she operates a private practice dedicated to providing exceptional services as a relationship and intimacy/sex psychotherapist.
Rapini is widely recognized as an esteemed lecturer, author, and television personality. She has made notable appearances as a guest expert on respected national media platforms such as CNN’s Prime News, CBS Up to the Minute, Fox National Morning News, Montel, Steve Harvey, the Today Show, Fox 26, and Dateline. Her insights were also featured in TLC’s Big Medicine, a two-season series, as well as Discovery Health Channel’s program about her own near-death experience, which aired on January 4, 2010. Furthermore, Rapini captivated audiences during her appearance on the Dr. Oz show on November 2, 2018, where she discussed the mysteries surrounding the afterlife.
Rapini’s expertise extends beyond television, as she has contributed extensively as a love/relationship expert for Your Tango and renowned publications including Cosmopolitan, Women’s Health, Men’s Health, Playboy, First, Seventeen, Teen, Redbook, and Self. She has also shared valuable insights through esteemed platforms such as the Huffington Post and the New York Times.
A highly sought-after keynote speaker, Rapini’s captivating speaking style resonates profoundly with individuals facing delicate intimacy issues and relationship challenges. She excels in guiding individuals through weight loss surgery and the transition to a healthier lifestyle, as well as addressing unspoken questions surrounding intimacy and sex in relationships. Additionally, Rapini has a unique talent for inspiring and empowering young girls dealing with body image issues, delivering a message that nurtures their transformation into resilient, self-assured women.
Rapini is an accomplished author of several influential books, including “Is God Pink? Dying to Heal” and as a co-author of “Start Talking: A Girl’s Guide for You and Your Mom about Health, Sex, or Whatever” and “Re-Coupling: A Couple’s 4 Step Guide to Greater Intimacy and Better Sex.”
Stay connected with Mary Jo Rapini:
Facebook – facebook.com/maryjorapini
Twitter – @maryjorapini
Instagram – @maryjorapini
Website – www.maryjorapini.com
Reaction Reset Handouts and Videos – www.maryjorapini.com/reactionreset
Books – www.maryjorapini.com/books
YouTube – www.youtube.com/user/mjrapini